The PC Vs Consoles debate !

[saumilsingh]

It's just the jaggies and the fact that they still doesn't look completely lifelike making the images appear kinda weird.

Even if they are retouched, photoshop can't completely transform the overall look.
They're probably like those early quake4 shots where certain soldiers were cropped and re-positioned to better depict an action scene.

 

[Params7]

But a pc can be used for so much more than just gaming.
It will catch up in the graphics department within 6 months, even less if the ps2 was any indication (it will render your dreams!), while the xbox was already outdated when it came.

You're missing the point.
Consoles are specially made for gaming, saying they don't cope up with PC's other functions is misunderstanding the whole reason to exist for the consoles.
In the gaming depart, what they're made of, undoubtedly better than PC gaming.
Even though the PC may catch up with graphics part a year or two later, like it has now from ps2-xbox. And if i still got the choice to choose from a 6600GT and an Xbox, i'd choose the Xbox, simply because its more worth than a 6600GT, and a longer life. People still proudly play Dreamcast, ps1, N64 bought ages ago, do you guys still stick to your Ti4200's and mx440's ?which were bought around the the same time as DC and ps1 for the same price, and they're extinct already ?
Trying to say is, those 11 thousand buck if you spend on a video card, is not only a part of a complete package for PC gaming, but has very short life compared to the consoles, in a matter of 2 years, cards like 6800Gt will start to age while there still be be games available and releasing for ps2, Xbox.
And part of the complete package i mean by that a video card isn't the only thing you need to keep upgrading after every 6 months or so, you need hard drive, you need ram, you need a faster processor, or other they along just won't work. Whereas for the consoles, no such thing is necessary, you can have tons of games without having to worry about disk space or install/uninstall, just pop in and play. there's no arguing consoles do beat PC in what they do best, gaming, where PC only has the upper hand in catching up a year later with better graphics, which alone isn't a reason to be no.1 in the gaming dept.
That's a long, but i just felt like saying that for a long time...

 

[saumilsingh]

You're missing the point.
Consoles are specially made for gaming, saying they don't cope up with PC's other functions is misunderstanding the whole reason to exist for the consoles.

So why talk about the pricing when a console clearly has nothing on a pc other than gaming.
Actually you missed the point, that's exactly why the price factor doesn't belong in a pc-console debate - consoles can't touch pc's in sheer functionality

Even though the PC may catch up with graphics part a year or two later, like it has now from ps2-xbox.

2 years? Are you kidding?
2 years later the ps2 launch, the pc had games like nolf2 & ut2003 and just an year later it got farcry. Don't tell me the ps2 could manage anything like that at launch or at anytime in it's lifetime for that matter.

The pc overtook the ps2/xbox within 6 months and continued to advance while those two remained static for 4+ years.
Sony just created too much hype about the ps2 before release while in the end it turned out to be little more than a really powerful ps1.

And if i still got the choice to choose from a 6600GT and an Xbox, i'd choose the Xbox, simply because its more worth than a 6600GT, and a longer life. People still proudly play Dreamcast, ps1, N64 bought ages ago, do you guys still stick to your Ti4200's and mx440's ?which were bought around the the same time as DC and ps1 for the same price, and they're extinct already ?
Trying to say is, those 11 thousand buck if you spend on a video card, is not only a part of a complete package for PC gaming, but has very short life compared to the consoles, in a matter of 2 years, cards like 6800Gt will start to age while there still be be games available and releasing for ps2, Xbox.
And part of the complete package i mean by that a video card isn't the only thing you need to keep upgrading after every 6 months or so, you need hard drive, you need ram, you need a faster processor, or other they along just won't work.

Yes but that's where the marketting genius of sony steps in, the console has no hand in it.

Theoretically if every ps2/xbox game was ported over to the pc with the same assets (ie no bumping up the resolutions which powerhouse pc's are capable of), it would run them better than their console counterparts at the same settings (for the sake of comparison I don't see why the pc should be required to run them at anything higher).

A 1.5ghz + ti4400 can run doom3 as good as any xbox at 640x480 low textures (same as what the xbox uses).
While an 800mhz + ti4400 can run gta3/vicecity/san andreas at 1280x1024 with sharper textures. Believe me I have tried, out of the 3 only gta3 runs bad because of the huge memory leak it has.

Whereas for the consoles, no such thing is necessary, you can have tons of games without having to worry about disk space or install/uninstall, just pop in and play. there's no arguing consoles do beat PC in what they do best, gaming, where PC only has the upper hand in catching up a year later with better graphics, which alone isn't a reason to be no.1 in the gaming dept.
That's a long, but i just felt like saying that for a long time...

Funny you mention that as if it's a good thing.
An initial one-time hassle is better than something you have to repeat everytime.
Permanently installed games with no-cd cracks >>> Constant disk and memory card juggling

I can be playing diablo2 in a window while surfing the web or be inside world of warcraft the very next moment while the ps2 is still loading maps.
And don't even get me started on the online play and mods.

In short the only reason consoles get better games is because companies keeps striking exclusive deals (sony + fia + money = no f1 games on pc till 2007).
So yes consoles have better games, but it's important to realise that the console itself isn't to be acreditted for them.

Ofcourse the bottom line is - marketting or no marketting, the ps2 does have better games and hence it's better. But that would just be ignoring the facts.
I own a ps2 and I do enjoy playing it more, so I am not just being a fanboy.

 

[Params7]

So why talk about the pricing when a console clearly has nothing on a pc other than gaming.

Actually you missed the point, that's exactly why the price factor doesn't belong in a pc-console debate - consoles can't touch pc's in sheer functionality

Consoles were not even MEANT TO touch pc's in other functionality's

For some like Dreamcast, it had support for a keyboard.

It was too cool to lie down in my living room sofa and surf internet on DC, sometimes they do have other functionality's, but regard it with what it does and made for - gaming.

2 years? Are you kidding?

2 years later the ps2 launch, the pc had games like nolf2 & ut2003 and just an year later it got farcry. Don't tell me the ps2 could manage anything like that at launch or at anytime in it's lifetime for that matter.

Do you realise there are console games out there that give Farcry a run for its money ? Tell me do you own a Gamecube ? have you played Resident Evil 4 on it ? Its the Farcry for consoles, and it matches it on the graphical and framerate department, reviews say the same and i've played them both.

For ps2 - the fact is its real power has STILL not be harnessed by the developers, and the same goes for Xbox and Gamecube. That's why first the people were angry that the next-gen is coming too soon. Some games like the cell shaded DBZ games, Gran Turismo 4, The Getaway, challenge Doom3 and Farcry in their graphical department badly, hell - Play Shenmue 1 and 2 on the 10 yr old Dreamcast now, tell me its THAT BAD when compared with Farcry, in fact it almost matches it besides being that old. Saying consoles are vastly inferior to the PC's graphical depart is immature.

The pc overtook the ps2/xbox within 6 months and continued to advance while those two remained static for 4+ years.

Do you really even own the ps2 ?

looks like when the PC overtook Ps2, ps2 was only halfway through too to show its real use of the 'emotion engine'

Sony just created too much hype about the ps2 before release while in the end it turned out to be little more than a really powerful ps1.

Sony did hype it. The really powerful ps1 were DC and N64. They both beat ps1 in the graphics depart. And ps2 was double the powerfull and faster than DC. By now way, is ps2, only a really powerful ps1.

Yes but that's where the marketting genius of sony steps in, the console has no hand in it.

There is no marketing without the product. Sure its launch library did have some games like SSX which helped ps2 beat the DC.

Theoretically if every ps2/xbox game was ported over to the pc with the same assets (ie no bumping up the resolutions which powerhouse pc's are capable of), it would run them better than their console counterparts at the same settings (for the sake of comparison I don't see why the pc should be required to run them at anything higher).

That's correct. i run ps1's emu, and the loading times are hella' fast. But the fact is it doesn't happen. Pc's don't get the console's settings, it uses a total different logic. Or else Doom3 on low on PC should look just as good as Doom3 on Xbox. When Doom3 launched on Xbox, people were surprise at how close and good it looked with compared with D3 on PC on high settings.

A 1.5ghz + ti4400 can run doom3 as good as any xbox at 640x480 low textures (same as what the xbox uses).

I don't believe this. Like said above, xbox ran D3 on 640x480, looked almost as good as high (1024x768) on PC.

Because, at 640x480 on the PC, it looks more like a ps1 game with square pixels are over the screen, that's not the case with Xbox.

While an 800mhz + ti4400 can run gta3/vicecity/san andreas at 1280x1024 with sharper textures. Believe me I have tried, out of the 3 only gta3 runs bad because of the huge memory leak it has.

Gta Sa got hammered badly on the graphics part. You should know that, blocky fingers, no facial expressions, lame atmosphere. GTA's are known for their gameplay not their graphics.

i bought GTA SA and played it on my Mx4000 because of the numeruous mods like hotcofee ( ) hitting it. I played it own 800x600. in the end, i had to get back to the GTA SA on ps2, because it had better graphics, smoother DESPITE ps2 running them in even lower reso's.

Funny you mention that as if it's a good thing.

An initial one-time hassle is better than something you have to repeat everytime.

Permanently installed games with no-cd cracks >>> Constant disk and memory card juggling

1. No cd-cracks are illegal, that voids your first argument.

While an average gamer own a 80 GB hard drive, it accomodates a max of 30-40 games (considering he does much less of other stuff like programs for example), to play more, he will have to uninstall and install, plus, you talk as if the 103246534 errors of software/hardware related error didn't exist. Often, gamers would run by the blue screen of death while playing their fav games, encounter a suddent restart by a virus or a hardware fault.

While nothing like that exists on Ps2.

The time it takes to turn on your PC = The time it takes to pop in the game + no tension of any stupid errors that could pop up and distract your gaming.

I can be playing diablo2 in a window while surfing the web or be inside world of warcraft the very next moment while the ps2 is still loading maps.

And don't even get me started on the online play and mods.

yea, but that's still bringing over PC's extra functionality's which the console don't offer. Besides, Xbox's live service for online gaming is just as good as PC's online gaming. I lived in SJ, Ca for a while and i subcribed for it, and i've played PC's online as well, i saw no major difference as you make out like. Xbox live does live up to PC online nicely.

In short the only reason consoles get better games is because companies keeps striking exclusive deals (sony + fia + money = no f1 games on pc till 2007).

So yes consoles have better games, but it's important to realise that the console itself isn't to be acreditted for them.

Ofcourse the bottom line is - marketting or no marketting, the ps2 does have better games and hence it's better. But that would just be ignoring the facts.

I own a ps2 and I do enjoy playing it more, so I am not just being a fanboy.

Yeah, where PC's have frequently shown to have much better graphics than the consoles, consoles have stricked back with their much impressive library.

PC's have better strategy library like AOE and Warhammer, while consoles have better beat-emup's like Tekken and Mortal Kombat. PC's have mods and trainers, Consoles counter that with Gameshark, Codebreaker and Action Replay cheat devices.

But at least consoles last forever. Videocards don't, RAM don't, while next gen releases, consoles revolutionze and do much more than gaming, Xbox and GC's real power has not been harnessed well yet....

 

[Aces170]

PC games will look like that within 6 months.
But yeah, the current state of pc gaming is sad - 10000 fps's with identical gameplay and revolutionary graphics.
Graphics instead of being a means unto the experience have ended up becoming the exprience.

Consoles atleast make good use of all that power, there's a huge variety of titles to chose from.
Flashback to the last few great games on the pc and they are all console ports! (pop1/2, kotor1/2 and fable)

You have M$ to blame for that they arent updating the Dx API fast enough, also you forgot HL2, the RTS games etc yep the consoles have their set of games, but I would select a PC any day over a console.

 

[Aditya]

PC >> Console .

But i will be buying the PS3. :E.

 

[saumilsingh]

@Params7
Again you missed the point each and every single time and ended up with a page full of bogus facts about shenmue, farcry, re4, and no-cd cracks.
I think there is even proof of gameshark being compared to the likes of counter-strike & natural selection somewhere in there, and disc-swapping actually being defended.

To put it simply - console games are better than pc games, but consoles aren't better than pc's for gaming (if it weren't for the exclusive releases).

 

[Sandy]

PC >> Console .
But i will be buying the PS3. :E.

hehe thought you had only 500-600 to spend and you want to get new graphics card :bleh:

 

[Params7]

@Params7
Again you missed the point each and every single time and ended up with a page full of bogus facts about shenmue, farcry, re4, and no-cd cracks.
I think there is even proof of gameshark being compared to the likes of counter-strike & natural selection somewhere in there, and disc-swapping actually being defended.

To put it simply - console games are better than pc games, but consoles aren't better than pc's for gaming (if it weren't for the exclusive releases).

That's opinion based, not a fact. Many choose the TV, the error free and comparitely much less cheaper and life lasting consoles over the PC.
Where some choose like keyboard and mouse, like the monitor and the now high end graphics of the PC.
Treat this like a race, consoles get to it first, PC later catches up.

 

[Aces170]

Where some choose like keyboard and mouse, like the monitor and the now high end graphics of the PC.

Treat this like a race, consoles get to it first, PC later catches up.

Huh ? PC can play any type of game, but can you play RTS or turn based games on consoles, nor can you play FPS on consoles. Though I admit the best of sports based games are released for consoles only...

In the end PC is any day better, only thing consoles have with them is relative ease of use. Thats the only reason they sell so well.

 

[saumilsingh]

That's opinion based, not a fact. Many choose the TV, the error free and comparitely much less cheaper and life lasting consoles over the PC.
Where some choose like keyboard and mouse, like the monitor and the now high end graphics of the PC.
Treat this like a race, consoles get to it first, PC later catches up.

What race? pc's are used to make console games in the first place.

Infact your next-gen xbox360/ps3 are already outdone even before release,
cryengine2 is dx10 based and far beyond anything those 2 will be able to handle.
But then I am sure something like re4 with it's completely pre-rendered backgrounds will strike you as technologically superior to farcry2.

As for longetivity, even for someone with severe ADD like me it took nearly an year to get bored of counter-strike while the majority others are still playing it.
And cs is just one game...

Sorry but a console will never be anything more than alternate living room entertainment, let alone achieve something as mildly shocking as actually replacing the tv.

 

[Params7]

What race? pc's are used to make console games in the first place.

Infact your next-gen xbox360/ps3 are already outdone even before release,

cryengine2 is dx10 based and far beyond anything those 2 will be able to handle.

But then I am sure something like re4 with it's completely pre-rendered backgrounds will strike you as technologically superior to farcry2.

Allright, now that has pissed me off. You need a reality check to stop pulling assumptions out of your ass. Re4 has put an end to RE-Prerendered era, in other words, no its not pre-rendered, and yes its almost on par with Farcry played high end cards, truth hurts but sometimes you have gotta' accept it.

And by RACE, i obviously meant what is available to the general public, and you knew that, there was no need to give that smartass reply.

Ps3 and 360 will be the FIRST to show off next-gen graphics. While Nividia and Radeon will be working on successors to cards like 6800GT to advance PC gaming along with it.

you know how the 'ps2' was termed as the SuperComputer at its release ? Why ? it too was made by computers...

As for longetivity, even for someone with severe ADD like me it took nearly an year to get bored of counter-strike while the majority others are still playing it.

And cs is just one game...

Sure there would be always some exceptions like Counter Strike. But generally

console games have crushed PC exclusives badly in the market along with its popularity -

According to the estiamtes - God Of War (ps2 exclusive) has beaten your 40 million $ production 'HALF-LIFE 2', hell, ps2's port of Gta Sa along chocked this game badly in the neck.

And you know the diffrence between the graphics of GTA SA and Half Life - Huge, Half-life is way better but still

heck, Gorgon Freeman, the hero of the series, was beaten in GAMEfaqs popularity polls by Leon Kennedy (resident Evil 2 and 4) and...you're gonna love this - a girl from a console beat em game 'Dead Or Alive 2' beat him badly in the polls.

There are very few PC exclusives that make it big, lately Counter Strike is supporting it, while the consoles are getting tons of exclusives that beat the *** out of PC games mostly. RTS games not included, that's the only genre PC has in its defense, and MMORPG's. Talk about RPG's, the most successful and famous RPG ever, ' Final Fantasy ' series has also never shown its face to the PC.

While you hide behind your counter strike, there are a whole LOAD of consoles games that have sold beyond the reaches of almosy any PC game.

In fact no PC games exclusive character ever, has goten even close to winning any of the best vharacter contests -

http://www.gamefaqs.com/features/contest/sum05.html

....trying to teach you graphics aren't everything, gameplay constitutes 75% of the fun, the rest to voice and graphics.

Sorry but a console will never be anything more than alternate living room entertainment

yeah from the examples i gave above, it sure proves you wrong buddy.

Especially this year the hype is much more than the hype for ps2, and once again we'll get to see PC gaming go by its near-death like it did in 2001 after ps2's release -

http://pc.ign.com/articles/092/092316p1.html

According to one of the similiar reports, PC gaming has financially suffered badly in the market comapred with combined Consoles software sales.

Heck, go to gamespot.com anytime, they update their mainpage frequently with the sales, popularity of games in the market - i hardly ever see any PC game up there, at least never on no.1, while ps2's port of GTA SA is still there, released ALMOST a year ago, and still in top 10 - i don't see counter strike anywhere in there, in fact there are only 2 PC games on the boards while the rest 8 own to the consoles - sorry, that must suck for you.

read this 2004 vidoe game market coverage, if you can hadle it.

http://biz.gamedaily.com/features.asp?article_id=8854

Despite the long-awaited releases of high profile titles like id Software's Doom 3 or Valve Software's Half-Life 2, the PC market only accounted for 15% of overall console and PC software sales. And only two PC games managed to surpass 500,000 units sold. In 2003, total PC game sales represented about 17% of the market....

You see, all this grpahics, the ram, the processoor, the super direct x12t-1 with XDultramechaconsolemaker video cards don't matter that much.

i know that hurts, but those are market estimates.

Thank-god for Counter Strike, the much awaited Half Life 2 got beaten in sales by one of the games called resident evil 4 (and NOT with pre-rendered backgrounds) and God of War(ps2) on the least popular consoles called the gamecube, sad huh ?

Also that site it very right when they say many exclusive PC games are running away to consoles, have you realised that, Singh ? Have you taken note of how many PC exclusives are going to consoles, and how many console exclusives are going to the PC ?

None!

Capcom stopped Resident Evil on PC after Re3

Doom3, first exclusived on PC, shocks PC fans in anger everywhere when a port was announced for the Xbox.

Farcry, i take this as your favourite game, ooooh that one of the best graphical games to date according to you, also is ready to ship and sell for the Xbox anyday now.

many more, and i don't think any console exclusive ever has made it to the PC except a very few..why should they..there's no reason too.

i know the mods will be offended at me talking like this, but i couldn't help it, you going on making false claim out of NOWHERE!

let alone achieve something as mildly shocking as actually replacing the tv.

yeah, would love to see dwell in front of your own TV while you wait for Radeon and Nividia to release their max 4 yr lasting 500$+ cards on par ps3's par for half a year while we enjoy the season on the ever life-lasting ps3's and 360's.

good luck to you.

And make sure, you've got enough RAM to support next gen, yeah and a good processor too, also make sure to update your drivers and OS again and again....and a good antivirus running so it doesn't spoil your gaming in between.

 

[Params7]

To put it simply - console games are better than pc games, but consoles aren't better than pc's for gaming (if it weren't for the exclusive releases).

that's the only thing, correct, you've said in the entire day.

Take Racing genre for example, what's the PC got - NFSU2 ?

Fact is - ps2 has that too, on top of that, consoles have MidNight Club 3 Dub Edition - better than NFSu2 in every possible way...belive me, i played through some stroyline in NfsU2, but Midnight club blows makes the whole underground criminal feeling of NfsU2 sort of...childish.

furthermore - nothing beats Burnout 3, period.

 

[Blade_Runner]

Thread slit from

http://www.techenclave.com/forums/nba-2k6-xbox-360-in-game-14949-2.html

 

[Params7]

great, now we have a seperate thread when i though of ending the argument.

Believe me Blade, this is going to grow into TE's biggest flamewar.

While PC's are better in consoles in raw power, graphics etc, consoles have better games out there and taking over the market slowly every day accordinng to the estimates.

Any thing else said in the subject would be honestly opinion based facts (Like outright nonsense from singh which said i like Re4' pre-rendered graphics better than Farcry, and that PC's are ultimate gaming machines and such)

and the fact that India is hardly into consoles, most of the opinions here are going to be biased!

Anyways...

 

[Blade_Runner]

Hehe carry on. just make sure you guys don't get personal .

I haven't taken the bite yet might jump in later

 

[Aditya]

@ Sandy, PS3 is coming as a gift :bleh:

 

[Freefrag]

pc is nyday better as the graphics keep on improvin were as,the consoles improve their system once in 3 or 4 years........

 

[Aditya]

Thats true, but when Console games start off, the graphics arent the best what the Consoles can do, Eg. NBA 2006 on XBox 360 is surely not the best xBox 360 can do, while 2007 and 08 maybe the best.

The Graphics keep improving as the game developers come to know the Hardware better.

Ofcourse, i have hidden the IDE cables.

Im looking for good sleeving too.. Does any1 have some?

 

[Chaos]

Well simply put, in graphics, AI, sound by comparing purely the hardware capabilities, no console can match a PC. Hell even the next gen consoles can be outperformed in pure graphics+AI+sound by a 2GHz Pentium with a 6800GT and an Audigy2. However the big plus of a console is the common platform thats exactly the same across all users. It helps optimize the games much more than PC games which must run on a variety of hardware. Consoles have a bigger and probably higher quality game library cos of this fact. Both platforms have their uppers and downers. I would not single out either as better or worse. Its the software that decides which is better. The typical audience at which games are targeted is generally different as well.