OMG! what a loser! See this ridiculous rant by someone's whose clearly braindead

superczar said:
so you think they perpetrated fraud..care to elaborate how?
Click to expand...

Isnt it human nature to question any abnormalities around them??? I am not saying a fraud was committed but all I am saying is that the margin with which Congress won looks questionable at first sight and even second sight...and should be examined.... from 100 seats to like above 250 seats, thats a huge jump. Before election the no. of seats congress won would have been in the category, too good to be true...and arent we used to the term...."If its too good to be true its too gud to be true"
 
This thread is one of the prime examples of conformity. Majority here declared the author an "idiot" without even reading the whole of his article, just because of the thread title and in accordance with the posters' opinion before their own.

Save for the EVM issue, which cannot be ignored as pure hogwash without concrete reasons and proofs, I would like to read counter-arguments by my fellow members, in the spirit of downplaying the author's idiocy and putting him in his place. Blr_p talked about some. Let' hear it from others as well.
 
I dont know about the author....but after recently watching the documentry Zeitgeist....i have my own conspiracy theory :eek:hyeah:

Did the Americans help the Cong/UPA come to power?? :bleh: :bleh:
So that they can have a friendly govt esp with all the big ticket deals coming up between US n India and for various other reasons?? :bleh: :bleh:

The Americans have been pretty friendly recently havent they??

Ponder over this :clap: :clap:
 
This thread is one of the prime examples of conformity. Majority here declared the author an "idiot" without even reading the whole of his article, just because of the thread title and in accordance with the posters' opinion before their own.

Save for the EVM issue, which cannot be ignored as pure hogwash without concrete reasons and proofs, I would like to read counter-arguments by my fellow members, in the spirit of downplaying the author's idiocy and putting him in his place. Blr_p talked about some. Let' hear it from others as well.
Click to expand...

Oh man...so your need for adopting a contrarian stance is so acute that you even stoop down to defending a baseless and ill-researched piece of trash

If at all the article had any merits worth considering, it's all frittered away by the absurdity of the climax

and to top it all, the author tries to portray himself as an expert on technology to lend credence to his inane allegations (thus proving himself to be no better, if not worse than say a sensationalistic reporter on India TV ) ...

and thus the author (and the article) lose any privilege or worthiness of a careful analysis IMO

PS: I had to keep myself away from replying to the other thread, and this would be my last post on this thread too..I really don't think it's worth my time to be arguing with you
 
what a crap piece of words.

i straight went to the bold conclusion.

there was some person who tried to emulate hacking EVMs (iirc it was in haryana or punjab). and publicly tried to malign the EVMs.

The BEL engineers immediately rebufed the thought and practically proved the allegations wrong.

The EVMs have simplified the election process a lot, confident, trustworthy and fast.

A big plus its ecofreidnly, imagine how much paper is saved.
 
superczar said:
Oh man...so your need for adopting a contrarian stance is so acute that you even stoop down to defending a baseless and ill-researched piece of trash

If at all the article had any merits worth considering, it's all frittered away by the absurdity of the climax

and to top it all, the author tries to portray himself as an expert on technology to lend credence to his inane allegations (thus proving himself to be no better, if not worse than say a sensationalistic reporter on India TV ) ...
and thus the author (and the article) lose any privilege or worthiness of a careful analysis IMO
Click to expand...
I have always wondered how easy it for a common man to disregard any piece of information without a scientific and rational inquiry into the matter -- solely based on his flawed judgment and slam it against his concrete wall of faith and belief.

skepticism
One entry found.

Main Entry:
skep·ti·cism Listen to the pronunciation of skepticism
Pronunciation:
\ˈskep-tə-ˌsi-zəm\
Function:
noun
Date:
1646

1: an attitude of doubt or a disposition to incredulity either in general or toward a particular object2 a: the doctrine that true knowledge or knowledge in a particular area is uncertain b: the method of suspended judgment, systematic doubt, or criticism characteristic of skeptics3: doubt concerning basic religious principles (as immortality, providence, and revelation)
Click to expand...

There! I'm a skeptic. And I owe it much to philosophers like Bertrand Russell and Kant.

Now read this:
CEO to bring EVM tampering to EC’s notice for action

M. Malleswara Rao

2009041450110101.jpg

Poll officials checking the functioning of EVMs.​

HYDERABAD: Taking a serious note of reports questioning the tamper-proof feature of electronic voting machines (EVM), Chief Electoral Officer I. V. Subba Rao on Monday decided to bring these instances to the notice of the Election Commission for suitable action against them under law.

In a blog, an IIT graduate challenged this particular feature of the EVM being claimed by the EC as well as its makers — Electronic Corporation of India Limited (ECIL), saying that the data introduced into the EVM could be erased by exposing magnetic field to the machine.
Memory loss

The CEO also received reports suggesting that the EVM also would lose its memory if it was exposed to magnetised polythene paper or if a cloth coated with detergent powder was rubbed against it.

Mr. Rao told The Hindu that the EC would order an inquiry into the demonstrations allegedly held by some persons to show how the EVM data was vulnerable to tampering. First of all, the EC officials would find out how the demonstrators secured the machines which were not parted by the EC from anywhere in the country, under any circumstances.

He said the ECIL made the EVM after years of research. “The machine is robust and can withstand Indian weather conditions. Without power, it can work for two days. Its functioning is time-tested, having been used in successive elections. One can’t presume that it will go wrong.â€

He foresaw no problem to the polling in the State as 10 per cent of the 1.33 lakh EVMs provided to the State would be kept as “buffer stockâ€.

© Copyright 2000 - 2008 The Hindu
Click to expand...
Source: The Hindu : Front Page : CEO to bring EVM tampering to EC’s notice for action

I'm sure my fellow members have access to EVMs and they have scientific proof that it cannot be tampered at all. Right?

superczar said:
PS: I had to keep myself away from replying to the other thread, and this would be my last post on this thread too..I really don't think it's worth my time to be arguing with you
Click to expand...
You fail to impress me.
 
spindoctor said:
you certainly are.
Click to expand...
Don't make me entertain you. I really am busy right now.

Besides, if you cared to read his post you would know why he deserved the adjective. You just enrolled yourself to his department.
 
alsiladka said:
That is something which is theoratically possible. But so is taking over the booth and filling up all the forms to cast the vote for your candidate, something which would take place when voting wasn't on EVMs.
Click to expand...

Taking over booth, actually was a norm.. Atleast in smaller towns... I have seen it myself during 90s... Boxes and Boxes of Ballots being replaced with tampered ones..

EVM must be having its flaws but so does every technology..

I didn't go through the "rant" .. But just by going through user posts.. Seems like we are again arguing over UPA Vs NDA :bleh:

Its over guys.. Just because the margin was huge doesnt mean there has to be a conspiracy... There is proper explanation in dailies as to possible reasons behind the huge margin.. (Not that you have to believe it, Just for the sake of perspective) ;)
 
Yamaraj said:
Don't make me entertain you. I really am busy right now.

Besides, if you cared to read his post you would know why he deserved the adjective. You just enrolled yourself to his department.
Click to expand...

at the end of all this, you're the one whining like a baby. get over it, the upa won the election.
 
Yamaraj said:
In a blog, an IIT graduate challenged this particular feature of the EVM being claimed by the EC as well as its makers — Electronic Corporation of India Limited (ECIL), saying that the data introduced into the EVM could be erased by exposing magnetic field to the machine.
Click to expand...

A little bit of googling reveals a professor in the US by the name of Satinath Choudhary, brought up this issue in 2004, the first time EVMs were used for a national election. He went as far as to file a PIL in the supreme court demanding the code used be made public so it could be checked. He was not successful.

Anyway, here is a blog post that appears to rebut the assertion that there was any tampering, in particular the linked to Expert Commmitee Report :)
 
blr_p said:
A little bit of googling reveals a professor in the US by the name of Satinath Choudhary, brought up this issue in 2004, the first time EVMs were used for a national election. He went as far as to file a PIL in the supreme court demanding the code used be made public so it could be checked. He was not successful.

Anyway, here is a blog post that appears to rebut the assertion that there was any tampering.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the links.

I'm of the opinion that until and unless a claim has been objectively falsified, people should abstain from instinctively calling it crap. I still, however, do not understand their hesitation from making the code open for public review. If it doesn't have any backdoor or bad code in it, I see nothing wrong with that.

To quote the author who rebutted the former's claims:

I have, of course, not assumed that the source code is clean. I have merely concluded that even if a political party were to be successful in manipulating the code at the time of chip production, it would still not be able to reap the benefits.

However, the valid point, which he doesn’t explicitly state is this: if the source code is not clean, the machine could malfunction. In practice, this is taken care of (partially) by tallying the number of votes cast at a polling booth (which is counted on paper-based electoral rolls) and the number of votes counted by the EVMs (which is an electronic count). If these numbers tally, it means that the EVMs have neither missed out a vote, nor inflated the vote count in any way.
Click to expand...

He is talking sense. And nowhere does his blog state that machines have been proved to be tamper-proof by independent public observers or in any court of law.

As long as we don't have sufficient information on validity of claims from either side, taking sides is a matter of personal preferences only.

To people confused about whether this discussion is about NDA's defeat and UPA's victory: read the article at least. Or stay put.
 
See the expert committee report, they have already performed a number of tests and this was back in 2007 !!

The charge in your article talks about using magnetic fields, but how do you ensure it only erases votes from a particular party :)

At the end if the total votes recorded by the machine do not tally with the number of votes cast it will be flagged which is presumably what a magnetic field might do.

Its surely far eaiser to use social engineering to get the job done but even then how could you pull it off in a manner that would swing a national election ?

Only conclusion left is maybe just maybe, they won fair & square :)
 
blr_p said:
See the expert committee report, they have already performed a number of tests and this was back in 2007 !!

The charge in your article talks about using magnetic fields, but how do you ensure it only erases votes from a particular party :)

At the end if the total votes recorded by the machine do not tally with the number of votes cast it will be flagged which is presumably what a magnetic field might do.

Its surely far eaiser to use social engineering to get the job done but even then how could you pull it off in a manner that would swing a national election ?

Only conclusion left is maybe just maybe, they won fair & square :)
Click to expand...

1. Did the committee have access to source code of EVM software? I don't see any auditing of the firmware deployed.

2. In the same Wikipedia link article posted (Electronic voting examples - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia, there have been concerns over tampering of EVMs in the Netherlands as well. A case was filed against a certain candidate accused of tampering with machines and it's still under prosecution. A certain Van Eck phreaking - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia method is also found be effective at this.

3. While it's not possible to erase only certain votes with magnetic fields if they are all stored in the same chip without any difference in parity or code sequence, it would be easy to achieve the same if the EVMs were (re)programmed in a way to not record votes associated with certain codes or skip the same while counting.

4. We still don't have sufficient information on the manufacturing process of machines, programming of the chips and the method of counting/recounting of recorded votes. I'm sure my fellow members will agree that it's easier to manipulate electronic data when compared to hard copies on paper. While EVMs are certainly eco-friendly devices, the need for a verifiable paper-trail is annihilated as a side-effect, which makes it impossible to audit any kind of fraud committed during the process.

5. I'm not contesting that it could all be just a figment of imagination. But it could also be truth. There's no way to know if we stop asking questions. The "everything is fine and dandy; the only truth is what we are told" attitude is against the spirit of the very democratic freedom my fellow members are so hell bent on relinquishing in favor of fanboyism. It's just an inquiry into why all those UPA members like Lalu, Paswan, Mulayam and Leftists fared so bad while Congress managed to score much better than expected. Lalu and Paswan were only giving Congress troubles after troubles with their new-found alliance. Good riddance, right?

On a lighter note: A movie Man of the Year (2006) discusses the same issue. A political satire.

Links of interest:

1. http://www.wired.com/politics/security/news/2004/03/62790

2. http://orissamatters.com/2009/04/23/1389_evm/

3. http://news.idg.no/cw/art.cfm?id=003AE63C-17A4-0F78-31DDDC0DCFA62609

4. http://www.wvcag.org/news/fair_use/2004/07_01e.htm

5. http://www.merinews.com/catFull.jsp?articleID=15767177

6. http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2006-06-26-e-voting_x.htm

7. http://www.mcclatchydc.com/226/story/64711.html
 
Back
Top